Will Robbins & The Mini Tour Grind

In this episode, pro golfer Will Robbins shares insights into international golf tournaments, course conditions, and the intricacies of qualifying for major tours. He discusses his experiences across Europe, the challenges of the grind, and the innovative equipment he's using to improve his game.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:31

Driver off the deck. Driver off the deck. Driver off the deck.

SPEAKER_06 0:47

You have to put your foot on the gas. You pull out the driver off the deck and you put it on the drain all the way up the hill.

SPEAKER_03 0:55

Welcome back to another episode of Off the Deck. I am your host, Josh Decker. Uh joining us from across the pond today, head golf coach, Mr. Will Robbins. Will, how are you?

SPEAKER_02 1:08

It's going good over here. Going good. So just enjoying uh actually the Mediterranean on the coast of Spain.

SPEAKER_03 1:14

Not bad. Not bad. There are worse places to be. So I want to hear. What events are you playing? We can start there, and then we'll go backwards into your history and how you got to where you are right now, what we're doing, or what you're doing. But what are you playing in? What have you played in? What's next on the schedule? What does all that look like?

SPEAKER_02 1:35

So what I'm playing in, it's it makes up the Nordic golf tour. But the Nordic, it's actually the Nordic Golf League. But the way it works is it's run by two different tours. So the Swedish tour, which is the Cutter and Buck Tour, and then the Danish tour, which is the Echo Tour. So I've played my first time ever playing anything with this tour, either one of them or the Nordic League. And I played in two events already north of Barcelona, about an hour and a half, that was run by the Swedish company, the Swedish tour, the Cutter and Butt Tour. Great courses, great facility, great hotel. It was nice. Stayed and played. They fed us three meals a day. Was able to practice whenever we wanted. Um very, very well run. So haven't played one yet of the Echo Tour. I actually have a tea time tomorrow at 9:10 this time. So Eastern time, it's what, 3.10 and central, it's 2 10 in the morning.

SPEAKER_03 2:43

Okay. I was about to ask you what the time zone difference is like. And and this is for my own education as well, as something I think the people would be curious to understand. What are the what do these tours then feed to and what is the end goal here for you as you're over there grinding?

SPEAKER_02 3:00

So the big the big reason why I why honestly I'm I came back over to essentially give it another shot after stop playing was one playing well, two, this tour itself, the top five at the end of the season in the order of merit points, gets full status with the hotel planner tour, which is like the Corn Ferry tour for the DP World Tour. So it's unlike mini tour golf in the States, you can actually graduate up from mini tours over here in Europe. Okay. Which is nice.

SPEAKER_03 3:41

So kind of like uh for lack of a better understanding on my own part, like what Brooks Kepka kind of did. Is that what's this kind of path is like he started I yeah, it's similar.

SPEAKER_02 3:52

I'm starting a lot lower than what he did. I think he started out at like the hotel planner. I think he came over, did I don't know if he got exemptions or if he did Q school and then got full status with back then it was a challenge tour to then he graduated from challenge tour to DP, played ball on DP, and then was able to top 25 on DP at the end of the year, go they have the option to take a PGA tour status.

SPEAKER_03 4:19

Okay. So how many events have you already played? I played two. Okay. And how did we finish in those?

SPEAKER_02 4:26

Uh the first one I ended up finishing tied for 28th. Um it was a battle back. I was five over through my first eleven holes and was able to get it back to where I ended up shooting three over in the first round, four under in the second, and then one under in the third. Okay. So got it back in there to where I can I could play, and I did not have a good finish on my last two holes either. I was three under going into eight on the last round. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 4:59

Yeah, yikes, yeah. Yeah, knew that math.

SPEAKER_02 5:03

Yeah. Yeah. And in the practice round, the eight, the eighth hole, because I started on the back nine, the eighth hole was a it's like a 610-yard par five, I think. And all practice rounds that I played beforehand with Connor and that, he we hit driver off the T and never had an issue with the water through the fairway. And stood on the T, looked at where the wind was. It was a little bit down on the cross and just hit my T ball straight into the water. Never picked the T up, thinking, okay, it's great, it's good. And then I see a splash.

SPEAKER_03 5:38

So Adrenaline or it was just the wind and conditions, and it was firmer and faster? It wasn't firmer and faster.

SPEAKER_02 5:46

So three weeks prior to the first event, the head, I believe he was the head pro showed us pictures of the golf course, and they had gotten two meters of rain. The golf course was under, well, the golf course itself was under two meters of water. When we got there a week before everybody else did, because we came over about 10 days before the first tournament, and they had, I know of at least two generators hooked up to multiple pumps pumping water out of fairways. So it was, and you could see the water level. I mean, the nine the two 18th greens were both underwater. Um half of the Dunes golf course was completely underwater. I mean, it was it the fact that they had it in the shape that they had it, because I mean the greens, the greens were great. Uh on the Dunes course, they were running, I think the final day that we played, they were running a 12. Um the forest course was probably a 10 and a half to an 11. Um, but they were two completely opposite golf courses as well. So one was tree-lined, where it's it was really neat seeing it because they they don't top the trees, but they trim all the whims from the base of the tree up to the very top. So it was like a canopy on top of all the, yeah, it was really, really neat. But the first round, we played, so we played 10 holes. Well, we didn't finish the 10th on the first round, and they called it due to wind. So we had, I think it was like right around 30 mile-hour winds, and the Dunes course has no trees on it, and they were running, like I said, like in a 12, and the balls were just moving all over the place. The guy, I hit a wedge into the 10th green, I think it was 75 yards. I played at 90, and a guy in my group was up at the green, and he said, When you hit it, it went all the way to the back of the green, and it came back short of the pin and then rolled off the front. From when it from when it was in the air to when it landed, it landed short of the pin. He's like, it was the wildest thing I've seen. But when we went back out to start the next day, there were golf balls all over the golf course because the trees would catch him with the way they have the canopy built on them. Oh that's wild. We yeah, like I hit my t-ball a little bit left on 11, and we were the first group to play 11, and we walked by like four or five balls thinking it was mine, but it they had just come out of the trees.

SPEAKER_03 8:35

From the wind. Yep. Yeah, that's nuts. So you're obviously chasing it, right? I mean, you're over there grinding, and I I think we all have uh we all have an immense amount of appreciation for someone like you doing what you're doing of chasing that dream. And I think we also all just the listeners of this show and me personally think that it is probably an excruciatingly stressful and difficult experience doing what you're doing. Is it as miserable as I expect that it is, or is is it somewhat better than that? Um It is.

SPEAKER_02 9:15

Yes, it is a grind. Um, there is no doubt about that. It is because it's your job. And if you don't perform, you don't get anything from it. Like, for instance, I came over to play these five events because this the Nordic League has a Q-Scal in the fall that I didn't go to. So they have these five events that are what they call their winner open series, the first one of two. And where I didn't have status with the tour, I came over to play to get status. So, like if if I make a cut, which I did in the first event I played, it guarantees me status where I can play in the remainder of the events throughout the year, except for the tournament of champions.

SPEAKER_04 10:00

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 10:00

Or the tour championship. I obviously would have to earn my way back to that um to be able to play there in that event. But like coming over with no status, I mean, yeah, it it it definitely is like, okay, these five events determine my summer.

SPEAKER_03 10:21

And and what is the best case scenario of that look like?

SPEAKER_02 10:24

So I've I've made I I now have full status with the tour. With the Nordic League. With the Nordic League. Okay. So I can play in every event leading up to the tour the tour championship, which I think is in September. I don't think it's in October, and I don't know if it's in Denmark or Sweden. I haven't looked that far ahead. But I can play in every event leading up to that. Um the chances uh when I get back home, I mean, it looks like I'm probably going to be coming back over. It would be right after my open qualifier on the sixth, so it'd be like probably a seventh or eight. I'll come back over, and I I'm not for sure where I'm gonna base myself yet, but I'll be here from May pretty much till the middle of September.

SPEAKER_03 11:19

Goodness gracious. So yeah. And when you say base yourself, that that does that mean just figuring out where you want to live for that duration?

SPEAKER_02 11:29

So when I came over and played in England a few years ago, I came over with three other guys and we kind of bounced from Airbnb to Airbnb somewhat close to tournaments. So we never really had like a home base. Granted, we realized looking back on it, like after we had been there a while, it's like we could have based ourselves somewhere because hotels over there, they had a couple that I think it's called a sleep in in the UK that are actually really nice, but really cheap. And it's like we could have just stayed in those because they have them closer to tournaments. Um and we would have had a place to practice all the time instead of trying to find somewhere. And talking with guys, players here, as well as with the cutter and buck tour, I talked with a couple of the directors, and they said if you're going to play both, honestly, most of the Swedish events are towards the south end of Sweden. He's like, you can base yourself in Copenhagen or somewhere around like Copenhagen, and it would actually be not bad. You could drive to almost every event. And I got to talking to a couple players from from the Finland and from Sweden, and they're like, Yeah, you would be able to drive to almost every single event. The one in Finland you couldn't drive to, but he's like pretty much everything else you could. So right now I'm leaning towards basing myself around Copenhagen and then practicing, I've got to reach out to a couple different courses that have been suggested to see if excuse me, if I can get privileges there.

SPEAKER_03 13:10

And and that was one of the things that was gonna, I mean, because this whole thing fascinates me. I feel like there's tons of different layers of this onion of what you're doing. Uh, the cost associated, the just figuring out where you're gonna live and base yourself for a minute, to use your phrase. But then also you're not playing Bay Hill and and Pebble B. I mean, what are these golf courses like? I mean, I like you talked about one being two meters underwater, which I need to figure out what two meters is actually equivalent to.

SPEAKER_02 13:37

It's like two meters is like six and a half feet.

SPEAKER_03 13:40

Okay, that's a lot of water. Six and a half feet of water. Ton of water.

SPEAKER_02 13:42

Yeah. The uh the amount of rain, I don't think the amount of rain was two meters, but like when I asked him, that's what he told me. And then later on he had said it was the golf course was under two meters of water.

SPEAKER_03 14:17

That's a lot of water. So uh I guess my question with that is like, what is the quality of golf course that you're competing on to try and grind? I mean, you're the expenses are enormous, the purses are not like I I can't fathom just the the mental capacity that has to go into this, and then you show up at this random golf course in Sweden and don't have a clue what to expect.

SPEAKER_02 14:42

As far as later on, like the the Denmark events in Denmark and the Swedish events, everybody's told me the courses in Sweden are very, they're very good golf courses. They're not the best, but they're good golf courses. Okay. The ones in Denmark, I've gotten mixed reviews on uh from different people. Um so I it's one of those things it it's gonna be what it's gonna be. If it's not a great golf course or not in great shape, everybody has to play it. You might get some bad breaks, you might, you might not, but someone else is probably gonna get them too. Um it's just everybody's on the same playing field at that point. The one, the previous course that we played in the first two events, they used to host, I don't know if it was first or second stage of Q-school, is what another player was telling me way back in the day. So it it does have like some history of hosting higher level tournaments, which different from the courses I played in England, they actually had sprinklers in the fairway, where most of the courses I played in England, they relied just on the weather to water the golf course outside of the sometimes tea boxes and the greens.

unknown 16:01

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 16:02

Usually you really find Yeah. So the one that I'm playing at this week, it's a weird combo how they're doing it because they're renovating. I guess this golf course has two eighteens and an extra nine. And they're renovating one of the nines. So we're playing 18 on the lakes course, and then we're playing a combination of eighteen on the hills course and the ruins course. The this course hosted this past year's final stage for the DP World Tour.

SPEAKER_04 16:43

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 16:43

They've hosted it for the last seven years. Now the Lakes Golf Course is a great golf course, great conditions, great shape, awesome. The Hills and Ruins course, it's completely different. It's very undulated. Um a lot of steep climbs actually from T or from green to T. And it's part of the holes have been redone because it's from the other course that they're redoing. Some of the holes, some of the other holes have not been redone. So the holes that have been redone, you have you have firm greens that are slow, and then the holes that haven't been redone, you have faster greens than those, but they're soft.

SPEAKER_03 17:32

So I mean how do you how do you play around? I mean, do you know which or which and and have to Yeah?

SPEAKER_02 17:39

You can when when granted, playing a practice round, you figure out like what is what, but you can also tell when you look at them what green, like what holes are old and what holes are new.

SPEAKER_04 17:50

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 17:50

Um, it's very, very prevalent. There's a big difference. Um they're telling us speed-wise, both 18s are the same speed. Playing ruin hills ruined yesterday, playing lakes today, the lakes is probably a foot faster at least. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 18:12

Um I could tell by your how you prefaced that statement that you don't believe them. Yeah, whatever they had told you.

SPEAKER_02 18:19

No, because there's a there's a couple putts like that we hit in our practice rounds, and it's like, yeah, that should have either never stopped short of the hole or that should have been 10 feet past the hole. So it's it because there were a couple putts that we hit that it's like, okay, you have to absolutely crank on this. But it goes back to the same thing. Everybody's playing the same golf course. Right, right. So it's if you can if you can just play and think of it that way, I mean there's gonna be with something like that, you might already be eliminating 25% of the field before they even tee off.

SPEAKER_03 19:05

Yeah, just mentally they're out of it.

SPEAKER_02 19:07

Uh, but it's it makes it fun and interesting at the same time.

SPEAKER_03 19:12

Yeah, oh, I'm sure. So you're over there with Connor, uh, who I met at an event earlier this year, I guess last year now. Um, and are y'all just kind of jet setting around over this over these this five event stretch? Is that just, hey, throw your stuff in the car and let's go?

SPEAKER_02 19:29

So kind of, kind of not. Um one thing that's nice about playing this winter series is when you sign up for them and pay your entry fee and everything, housing's included.

SPEAKER_03 19:42

Oh, that's incredible.

SPEAKER_02 19:43

So yeah, so it made it nice where like I didn't have to go through and find a hotel to book at and where to stay or anything like that. And granted, this hotel we get breakfast and then we have to pay a small fee for dinner, which isn't bad, and then lunch is on our own. The last one, like I said, we were at the hotel and they literally provided us with three meals a day. Once the tournament started, so I think pri first official day of practice rounds was Thursday, but Wednesday they included dinner for us. And then from Wednesday to the following Saturday morning, I believe, they included three meals a day until the breakfast Saturday morning. Okay. So it was it in those regards, it was it was really nice. Um, because then we didn't have to worry about anything because Connor and I found out the hard way, even though I asked the guy when we got there about siesta, if they have a siesta. So he told me no. He's like, it's we don't have that here. Well, we go to grab dinner at five o'clock, like the first day that we're there, because we've been traveling, not really eating anything that day. Yeah, nothing opens till eight o'clock to eat dinner.

SPEAKER_01 21:03

Oh God.

SPEAKER_02 21:05

So we ended up fighting a pizza place in a small town that they opened at seven. And we're like, okay, we're just gonna. I called him at like I think it was 6 30, 6 45 to see if they would be open. He's like, yeah, we'll be open, but you won't be able to get it till like 7 10. I'm like, that's fine. Yeah, we don't care. We'll be there to pick it up. Yeah. Yeah. So which it was a very good pizza. But so having the tour provide food was was really nice because now like they moved, they had dinner for us ready I think every night at 6 30. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 21:47

So are these 54 54 whole events or 72 whole events? 54. Okay. Because I noticed you said through Saturday and I was curious.

SPEAKER_02 21:58

Yeah, so it's it's interesting kind of how they do them because like tomorrow, for instance, and it the last place we had two golf courses. We had the Forrest course and the Dunes course. Well, tea times run from I think like nine in the morning is the first, excuse me, to like eleven, eleven twenty, somewhere in that range. Split tea on both golf courses.

SPEAKER_03 22:27

That's a lot of entrance. Like how many people are participating?

SPEAKER_02 22:31

So it it is, but at the same time it isn't because they don't have an afternoon wave.

SPEAKER_04 22:38

Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_02 22:39

Okay. So they literally just have a morning wave. So, like for instance, the last two events I played, I think the field size was right around 145. Okay. I believe these are the these are the same as well.

SPEAKER_03 22:52

And top what and top Make it make the cut.

SPEAKER_04 22:56

Forty-five in ties. Oh, wow. Okay. So it's a big cut. Yeah. And what do those purses look like?

SPEAKER_02 23:04

Is there is there any money? So I don't I don't know how much I made from my one finish. They don't tell you how much you make. They just transfer you the money and get it and I haven't got it yet. But she said she was sending it out, but I've had issues going to American accounts from Europe before with events.

SPEAKER_04 23:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 23:27

And so I'm waiting to see what it ended up being for that one. But I know first place is right around 8,000 euros. So anywhere from 9 to 10,000 U.S. Each purse, each tournament's purse is 50,000. Anywhere they average about 50, but I think they have a couple that are higher, and then I think they have a couple that are like 40 to 45. Okay. So it's a good average I've kind of played off of is about 9,000 U.S. And I think second ends up getting someone was telling me it's around like the 3,000 euro mark. So about four grand, four to five grand.

SPEAKER_04 24:08

Oh, it drops off quick.

SPEAKER_02 24:09

Somewhere in there. It does. Yes, it does. But it's also it's I mean, it's about the same outside of Gary's, the G Pro Tour that runs in the southeast in the US. Um, which Gary does a great job with it because he's still the payouts are about the same as what his are about the same as what his are, except his for first, his are that much. For last place, he makes sure you get your entry fee back, which is uh right around a thousand bucks. Here, these tournaments are different, but looking at the remainder of the season, they're gonna entry fees are anywhere from after the exchange rate about 325 U.S. to 375 U.S. So instead of paying a thousand bucks for the same first place prize money, you're paying almost a third less than what you would be for like Gary's events. Plus, you have the opportunity to graduate up.

SPEAKER_03 25:42

And is are those the key differentiators between because I was about to ask, why are you not playing the events in the Southeast where you actually have a literal home versus all of the time, effort, and energy and resources that go into playing over there? Is it but is it because of the being able to graduate up?

SPEAKER_02 25:59

It's a combination of a bunch of different of several different things, I should say. Um one is being able to graduate up. Two is it's less in entry fees. And it's like traveling over here is a lot cheaper. So it's not gonna be near as expensive for me to travel to tournaments. So my break-even point over here is actually a lot lower than what my breake-even point would be in the U.S. Because, like, for instance, if I go to if I go to Gary's events and play in Gary's, it's a thousand dollars for an entry fee, which I can't remember, I don't know what his membership fee is nowadays. Um, so you're a thousand bucks an entry fee. You typically, I believe, have to pay for a practice round. So there's another 50 bucks. And then yardage books, I can't remember what Gary's doing now for yardage books or not, um, but they might be like 20 bucks. So before you even peg it up, if you figure entry fee, hotel, and if you drive to the event, you're if you're doing it alone, you're probably getting close to two grand, not including food. So then when you figure food in, you're 2200, probably 2,000 to 2200, depending on where you're playing at. So, which with Gary's it's a top 10 finish, would pretty much it'd probably put you pretty close to about a break-even for the week.

SPEAKER_03 27:38

Okay. And are people that are playing on that just trying to learn how to play competitive golf before because if you can't graduate up, if there's no status associated, is that just trying to sharpen your skills and the middle aspect and everything associated with trying to get better and potentially go to a Q school? Or what what is the end game with something like that? Because I I understand what it is with yours and why you went over went across the pond because you're trying to get into a different tier of tournament of, I guess, or a different um what's the word I'm looking for? Uh a status within a tour. Whereas this guy Gary sounds like he's got a bit of a racket. I I'd like to meet Gary, maybe have him have him on the show.

SPEAKER_02 28:21

So Gary, Gary's a great guy and he runs a great tour. And the one thing like I give him credit for is he always puts the players first.

SPEAKER_04 28:31

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 28:31

So he always tries to do what's best for the players. It's back in the day before before COVID, I think there would be like two or three events a year that you could play in in Gary's, and he would actually have spots in the Corn Ferry event. Or back then the nationwide. So it's like if you finished first or second, you could instead of playing in the Monday, you would get into the the Corn Ferry event.

SPEAKER_03 29:00

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 29:01

Since then, they've done away the PJ tours has done away with anything like that, to my understanding. Um I don't know, because I haven't paid a ton of attention to Gary's stuff the last couple years, but I know he used to do if you finish so high on his, I think he just has a money list at the end of the year, then you would he would pay for your Q school entry fee to Corn Ferry. That's cool. So and I can't remember what place it went down to, but I know he used to do that. I don't know if he still does or not. Um because I mean, last time I played Q School for Corn Ferry, I think it was$5,500 to enter. Goodness, Christmas. So it's like there, so there's there's a$5,500 bonus at the end of the season that now you don't have to pay because he's gonna take care of it for you.

SPEAKER_03 29:56

Yeah. I mean, and that is a like it's one thing if I go spend fifty, five hundred dollars on a vacation, but spending fifty five hundred dollars on like a potential well-being and something that is you're you're trying to do as a career. And how many days is Q school? Three, four? Uh it's four.

SPEAKER_02 30:15

So, but it's not it's not one tournament. It's a four-day tournament for three stages, if you don't have to go to pre-qualifying.

SPEAKER_03 30:25

Okay. Expound on that. I because I'm an idiot.

SPEAKER_02 30:30

So the way it works, for instance, like if you have if you haven't, I don't think they're doing anything with colleges now, but like if you haven't done Q school before, have a certain amateur ranking, you have to go to pre-qualifying.

unknown 30:46

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 30:46

Pre-qualifying is the first round of Q school, technically now. It's only three days. Last time I did it, I think the entry fee was it was either$2,500 and three thousand or three thousand. It was one of the two because then if you are successful through pre-qualifying, which it's a three-day event, if you're successful through pre-qualifying, then you pay another the remainder of the$5,500 is what you would end up paying. So it would either be another three grand or$2,500. Then you have from that you have first stage. First stage is four rounds, anywhere from 80 to 100 player fields, and they take roughly top 20, I think, anywhere from 15 to 20, depending on the field size. Okay. Then from there you would go to second stage. Second stage, it's I can't remember how many locations they have now. It's another four-round tournament. And they take last time they had it at Southern, I think they took like top 14 in ties. Anywhere, I think it's another kind of based off field size, it's anywhere from like 12 to 15 players.

SPEAKER_03 32:05

So there's other stage ones all around the country, and then there are a handful of people, like the top 15 from these stage ones go to stage two at this location. Is it is it kind of like an NCAA bracket where it gets pared down, but we have different locations where, or I guess a U.S. Open qualifier where you have different like sections that get okay.

SPEAKER_02 32:27

Yes, it's very similar. The only difference is that you have to remember too is there's guys that have Cornferry status that exempts them from certain stages. Okay. So you have those guys coming into the mix too. Cause there's some I I last I remember, I think it was if you finished 89th or higher at the end of the year on Cornferry in the order of merit, you were exempt from first stage and could go to second. I can't remember what the number was to where you were exempt to go to finals. So because then you have after second stage, you have a final stage of qualifying that second stage, I think, is usually there's six different sites, is how it used to be. And they would just take all the players from there, all the players that have status, have some sort of status with PJ Tour and Cornferry, and they all go play final stage. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 33:25

So how many total people typically sign up and pay the$5,500 in her Q school nationwide? What's that number? Just a ball, just a guess.

SPEAKER_02 33:36

So if you've got a calculator handy, last time I remember counting the sites for first stage, it was 13. 13 times 13 sites. So let's say the average field size was 90.

SPEAKER_04 33:51

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 33:52

So 13 times 90 times 5,500. What's the 5500? That's your entry fee.

SPEAKER_03 33:59

Oh, whoa, whoa. Well, oh so I was doing the uh how many actual people were entering. The number of players. Yeah, so 13 times how many?

SPEAKER_02 34:06

So 13 times 90 is starting at first stage.

SPEAKER_04 34:10

Okay, so leveling I think people.

SPEAKER_02 34:13

And that's not including I think it's six sites at right around the same amount of players. It probably averages 80 and pre-qualifying last time I played it. So another, what, 480 players roughly on top of it. So 1,500 if you go all the way back to pre-qualifying.

SPEAKER_03 34:35

And how many will actually make it through, like how many will end up going making it through Q school out of the 1200 or so? Or I guess 1600 that we just figured out math-wise.

SPEAKER_02 34:45

I'm trying to think here, because I can't remember the the number of players that was in final stage, but I think it was right around 200. 200 players were at final stage. Now with Corn Ferry, if you make it to final stage, you have status of some sort. It might be shit status and or it might be it might be because they've changed it so much the last like two, three years with the Americas tour that they have. Because I think some guys will have like full America status, and some guys have like a conditional status, what they call with the Cornferry. So they might not get into some events, they might get into some. It all depends on the reshuffle. Because after so many events on end of the season, I think Cornferry does, I think it's two reshuffles. Okay. Where if you're not performing, you lose, you knock down in status, and then guys can come up.

SPEAKER_03 35:47

That's brutal. So it's yeah, yeah, it is. So I did do the math though on on you look uh like you were asking about the fees. It's almost six and a half million dollars that could that come in from course farewell. Q school entry fees. That's insane.

SPEAKER_02 36:03

Yeah. You don't want to know the numbers on Mondays. It's even higher.

SPEAKER_03 36:09

Is it really?

SPEAKER_02 36:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 36:11

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 36:12

Because you have to figure, so they have they have two entry fee for every month.

SPEAKER_03 36:16

That's not even you're not even playing.

SPEAKER_02 36:19

Yeah. So I mean they have it's I want to say for Corn Ferry, they use two golf courses. I think it's it's a minimum of$180 per golf course. It's closer to$200 if I was guessing. At$550 a pop. So essentially just on low numbers,$350 per Monday at$550 an entry fee.$200,000 in one day. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 36:51

Yeah. Man, you gotta really, really love the game of golf. I mean, especially just what you've told us in the 30 minutes we've been recording about everything you're dealing with. And then to to try and do that day like Monday in, Monday out, try and just to qualify and then be on the road. I mean, are are you playing right now over there with any sponsors, or is this stuff that you've just kind of you're funding yourself?

SPEAKER_02 37:16

Just kind of funding myself right now. I mean, there's it's mostly all on me right now. When I come back to the States, I'll see if depending on how these next few go, um, there's a company that I know that deals a lot with um, they're based out of Europe and they deal a lot with the countries that I'll be in. Um so I'll reach out to them and see if there's a possibility there. Um and then there's a couple other either companies or friends of mine that have helped me out in the past that no matter, excuse me, no matter what, just because of the support that I've gotten from them, I always like I have shirts that have their logos and that on them that I always wear an event.

SPEAKER_03 38:00

That's cool. That's really cool. Well, I I hope it goes incredibly well for you over there, but also miss you. Um, one of the fun things about this is uh you and I met at a lovely place, the first time we ever played golf together, uh, a little place called Bandon Dunes. Um that was hard to it's hard to believe that was just a year ago. Um, but what a trip that was.

SPEAKER_02 38:26

Yeah. It was. And I actually the gray and khaki hat I still wear. I'm still wearing it over here in tournaments that we got from that trip. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 38:35

And I've heard you talk about that hat multiple times. Um we had a friend who was on that trip with us who did uh a uh was it Branded Bills, I think is the name of it, that brand. Um and they were incredible hats. Uh but yeah, I've I yours has certainly seen better days. That hat is is worn since.

SPEAKER_02 38:54

I'm looking at it now, and the khaki at the seams is not really khaki anymore. It's pretty much black.

unknown 39:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 39:02

Um but that was a great trip. What was your what was your favorite course uh at Bandon last year?

SPEAKER_02 39:09

Or had you been there before? No, I had never been there. That was my first time there. Um it's tough. I mean, I really like Old Mac and I really liked um Sheep's Ranch. Um to me, that was the closest you like to the Lynx golf that I've played in the UK. Pack Dunes, what I played of it from what people have told me, because I haven't played the west part of Ireland, it reminds them a lot of that area. Okay. Um so like Sheep's Ranch, Old Mac is probably my favorite, but the most underrated one out there is Trails. Trails is I absolutely love that golf course, and nobody really talks about it. And it's like that's the course that you should because you don't. I mean, yeah, it's tree lined, it's not a dunes course, it's not a length course, but never in a million years did I think I would play a golf course that looked like that aesthetically, and the different the ways that they would build it, and it just messed with your depth perception throughout the entire round. You couldn't tell how far anything was. And if you didn't have rangefinders or yardage book, you would hit it into so many bonkers or into gorse and junk, and you would have no clue about it.

SPEAKER_03 40:36

Yeah. Yeah, you're absolutely right. I mean, and trails is anybody that I talked to about Bandon, I talk about trails. Um I mean, it's not the the big headliner, right? Like you talked about with old Mac and Sheep Ranch, but it was the one that I probably had the most fun on, uh, other than when I went and played uh the Bandon Preserve, which was one of the par threes. Um, but that's where we we kind of we were down there in that cigar bar one night and talked talking about my takeaway and getting we were we were deep into it uh and left there with um you affectionately being known as my my golf coach. And just one of the things I enjoy about talking to you about my game is you uh I am not a technical player by any stretch of the imagination. If people start using terms of you're too far inside, you're too far out, but I I'm lost in that. And you do a great job of just no, here, move this a little bit this way, move that a little bit that way. And it always works. Um, do you do you miss teaching? Is that I mean, I know you've you've done it in the past. Is that something you want to get back to doing eventually or no?

SPEAKER_02 41:39

So I do still have a few people that I work with when like when I come back, there's a couple juniors that I will help out with. And then there's a couple guys that when I was with the academy when we met, that I started instructing through there, and I'll I'll still give them lessons. I do enjoy it. Um it's the side that with instruction, I feel like people get the most out of is actually, especially at an amateur level, is actually learning how to play. Because there's a lot of people that just don't understand, okay, it's a front pin, it's a hundred yards, I need to hit it a hundred yards. I've got a hundred yard club. Well, guess what? You've got another 20, 30 yards behind the pin. You don't have to hit it 100 yards. You've got room you can go long, where if you go short, it could be water, it could be an elevated green and you're short-sighted and you can't stop it. I mean, it's I enjoy teaching that. And honestly, I really enjoy teaching wedges and shots around the grain because there's so many different ways, so many different techniques. And if someone doesn't really have a good short game, they're gonna pick up shots really quick just from knowing now all of a sudden they can get up and down, it that makes a massive change in someone's game. So I I will still do it a little bit when I get back. Um obviously being gone over the summer, it's gonna be hard for me to do instruction. Right, right, but uh yeah. But I and that's I tell everybody that I help, hey, look, if you just take a video and send it to me, I'll be more than happy to take a look at it and I'll ask you questions and see where you're at and see what's going on, and I'll do my best to help you, even though like I'm not there. Yeah. Um just because I know when you have a especially someone who loves the game and they want to get better at it, when you have a good relationship with a coach, it makes a world of difference with how you play and how you perform. Because if something kind of starts going awry, you can reach you know you can reach out to him and be like, okay, we're good.

SPEAKER_04 43:57

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 43:59

No, I mean at least and that's I've got a a guy that helped me before I stopped playing. He had helped me with my putting in the past. And I mean, Paul Henderson, he was a great player. Um, he's based out of Orlando, he's not really teaching anymore. And I just sent him a message, hey, struggle a little bit with the putter. Do you care to take a look? Sure. Send me a couple videos, send him a couple videos. And the one thing like I really like about Paul is when we first started working together, he's like, technically, there's nothing massively wrong with your stroke. He's like, it's fine. And we just made a couple tweaks, not even in setup, just in my routine before putting. And it made a world world of difference before I stopped playing to where I started actually making a lot of putts. But then at the same time, when I felt like something was wrong, kind of like when I first got here and something was off, sending those videos, he's like, everything looks great. Ball positions up just a touch, move it back like a half a ball. And it should bring your contact, because my contact was a little off with it. He's like, it should bring it back to perfect. And I made, I've, I mean, I've actually been rolling the putter really well since I've been over here since then. But if nothing's wrong, he's going to tell me nothing's wrong. And that's why I enjoy going to him because sometimes as players, we think something's off and nothing's off. Everything looks good. Everything looks fine. It's just we get in our head about it because we're thinking about it.

SPEAKER_05 45:31

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_02 45:32

So what did he change in your putting routine? So I had I had a lot of dead time to where before I would actually putt, I would look at the hole three times roughly, and I would have a lot of stagnant energy. Like I wouldn't be doing anything, it'd just be still. Okay. And we got rid of a couple looks. So now it's I'll look once or twice, depending on the length of putt or how much it's breaking, just to confirm my line. And essentially, as soon as I look back from the hole the last time, I fire. I don't stand there, I don't wait, I don't look at the ball, I look back at the ball. And my trigger for putting has always been putting my thumb down on the top of the putter grip. Yep. So as soon as I look back, I put my thumb down and just stroke the ball. Because when you're when you get rid of when you have a lot of dead time or a lot of time that you're over the ball, especially putting, you have time to think. The more time you have to think, the more shit that creeps into your head, whether it's good or bad. So when you get rid of that, it gets rid of the aspect of you thinking and trying to change something while you're over it, but it also turns it into where now you're just being an athlete and just putting. So it allows you to, like I said, just be an athlete and react.

SPEAKER_04 46:59

Thinking about a whole lot less. Yes. Yes.

SPEAKER_03 47:05

And how's so putting so that's that was all it took? Was just firing quicker and and less time look standing over the putter. That's crazy.

SPEAKER_02 47:14

That it would be.

SPEAKER_03 47:43

Okay. Wow. Maybe that's what I need to do because my putting right now is horrendous. Um, but one of the things that I'm the I guess whenever you get back over here, you and I have texted back and forth about is some new irons. Uh and hopefully my by now my wife has turned off this episode so she won't hear this part. Um but but we we have chatted about uh the new level, uh, I guess it's the 720 cavity backs. That might be the right number, maybe not. Yes. Um 702. 702. So tell me you sent them to me or shared a picture on Instagram about them, and they immediately caught my attention, especially just that copper-looking color because how cool it is. The process of building clubs and you getting the irons directly from the manufacturer, what does that look like? And then what goes into because I want to come witness this us actually building that set of irons.

SPEAKER_02 48:35

Yeah. So as far as getting it from them, it literally comes in a box about, I don't know, six by ten by ten. And can anybody just order these or do you have a relationship with new level? So I have I have a relationship and a and an and an account with New Level. Um New Levels, their, and I I use this term lightly when you compare the two products, but their main competitor would be like Tacomo. So they're a they're a direct-to-consumer company. So with Tacomo, you essentially get one head, one shaft. Last I looked, at least, you get no customization of it. It's just it is what it is. And personally, when I hit them, do not like the feel of them at all. Um the new levels essentially are for the same market. They're a you could call it a cheaper set of iron, but I will say their tolerances on their heads are very, very minute. Okay. So like tolerance. So weight, the weight differences between because every head needs to weigh a certain amount. Got it. So, and I I can't remember exactly what theirs was, but it's it's one of the tighter tolerances on weight. But then also the big thing I look at when I look at like manufacturers when I'm doing clubs is the hossle. So the hazle diameter for new levels are 370, which is a parallel tip. So it's 370 all the way down. There's no taper to it, like the 355s, like typically how clubs used to be made. Okay. It was usually a taper tip until you got into like a game improvement iron. Um, then they would go to a 370 tip.

SPEAKER_04 50:32

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 50:33

New levels are 370, but when I put the shaft in the hazle, it doesn't move at all. It's it is what it is, it's right there, it's perfect every time. And every time I build them based off of their standards, my loft is within a degree, and my lie angle is within a degree without even bending them or anything after I put them together. Whoa. So that's where to me it's like it's between the weight and then seeing that the first time I built a set a year ago with when they first came out with the 702s that were chrome. It's like they they're a phenomenal, they're a very, very well-built golf head. Now getting clubs directly from them, I would think would be the exact same way. I haven't sold full sets from them, and I haven't met anybody that has a full set from them.

SPEAKER_03 51:39

Okay. But you're you're gaming a set right now, like you're you're playing with a set you built, right?

SPEAKER_02 51:44

Yes. Of new levels. So of the new levels. So when they came out with the coppers, they also came out with a raw head. So and I I like the look of, don't get me wrong, I have a set of the coppers back at the house that came in after I left that I'm probably going to build for me as well. Just because they look really good.

SPEAKER_05 52:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 52:06

Um, especially because like now I have a black chrome finish in my shafts now. And I built a set of the coppers that you saw, I built with a black shaft in them, and they look really good, matched up to the raw and the copper. Yeah. Uh look sharp. So yeah, it did. So I'm probably gonna end up building that set to have is a backup set for me. Um they do put a tungsten weight out in the toe as well to help balance the head, and they the feel of them, it's it's like hitting, so to me, the feel of them is like somewhat like a Mizuno, okay, where they have a soft feel to them. Yeah, but they come off with a crack. So, like if you ever hit like um the ZX5s from Shrekson, um when you hit those, they have like this loud crack and pop that they are a hot head that the new levels have, even though they're not a hot head.

SPEAKER_04 53:20

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 53:21

So it's it's of to me, it's a feeling I absolutely love because I played Mizunos for years.

SPEAKER_03 53:27

Yeah. Which I did not know that a parallel because that's what I'm at, is the Mizunos.

SPEAKER_02 53:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 53:31

For now.

SPEAKER_02 53:32

For now. Yeah. So and it's I mean, I think if you get, and I can't remember exactly what the pricing is, but I think you could get into a set that might have an upgraded shaft, maybe not a grip, if you go directly from new level for like$1,200,$1,200 roughly somewhere in there. I can't remember if you can get into them cheaper or not. I know that's kind of I think you can. Um, I think you might be able to it now, granted, the coppers and the rolls are a little more expensive because of the heads. But the chrome themselves, I think you can get into them for right around a thousand bucks.

SPEAKER_03 54:17

That's not bad at all, especially for the high the type of quality that you just described in these irons. I mean, if you're going anywhere and buying anything with titalist or tailor made on it, you're gonna spend north of that.

SPEAKER_02 54:27

Oh, titless, I think, is a minimum 1,500. Tailormade is if you get any upgraded shaft, it's about the same. Callaway is about the same. All of them are about there. Yeah. And then granted, now I will say like Cobra, they came out with the 3DP irons, and those are really good irons as well. But they do also have a very nice price tag on them.

SPEAKER_03 54:52

Okay. Are the is that are those entirely 3D printed? Like the fact like the I mean the club had obviously not the sh the shaft, but every single set is 3D printed. Yes. I yeah, I I don't uh yeah. What in the Bryce and the Shambeau are we doing? I I don't I'm that I don't know what to do with that.

SPEAKER_02 55:12

Well, the thing of it is with that is like it allows them to put the weight exactly where they want it to get what they want out of the head. Okay. So I think like for instance, the 3DP irons, they have three different models, an MB, a tour, and then like a game improvement. Okay. So I if I remember correctly, the MB has a 70 gram tungsten weight that runs all along, excuse me, all along the bottom. The tour, I think, is it one, I think it's 110. 110 gram weight that runs all along the bottom, and I think a little bit out on the toe. And then I think the game improvement is like 130. 130 or 140 somewhere in there. I can't remember exactly on that one. And it's I think it's more so out on the toe and then down through the hazle or down through the bottom as well.

SPEAKER_03 56:08

So the 3D printing just allows them to be much more precise where the weight actually sits in the club.

SPEAKER_02 56:15

That and then they also came up with a lattice system that when they print it, it's like spider, it's essentially like a spider web throughout the inside of the head. Okay. That somehow when like for the game improvement, if you completely miss one, the ball is still gonna go within, I've heard within three yards distance-wise, is what it normally does. What? Yeah. Okay. The blade, the all all three of the 3D printed heads have that lattice system, and the forgiveness in them is off the charts. Yeah, that's insane. Within three yards? Is what now, granted, that's what I've heard. Oh, yeah, people are getting out of them. I don't, I don't know, because I can't remember, because Cobra, I think they did testing for that and they published the numbers, but I can't remember exactly what it was that they published.

SPEAKER_03 57:11

Okay. God, that's yeah, that's crazy. I'm gonna have to check one of those. Not that I I want a pair of Cobras because I want the new levels that you're gonna build for me and I want to be be part of that process, but that's nuts. I mean, within three, I can't hit anything within three yards of where I want to hit it right now. Just I don't I don't know how I could judge that because I don't know where it's going to begin with. So how am I gonna tell you if it's within three yards of where it was supposed to go?

SPEAKER_02 57:34

No, it's it's also one of those things too. I don't know if that includes like a wide open face or a shut face or anything like that, just as far as like off-center hits.

SPEAKER_04 57:43

Yeah. Wow. Okay. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 57:47

That's that's wild. That's I I will say that it like as far as the club building side where you're asking me with instruction and that stuff. Instruction wise, like I said, I love to teach people how to play and hit wedges. But I also I really love building clubs and fitting people into clubs. Because when you like for instance, I had a guy that he came to get fit when I was doing, when I was doing at the time, all I had was Shricks on, and I fit him into him, and he went from hitting an eight-iron 140 yards, which we're talking about someone that's swinging an eight-iron over 90 mile an hour, and all the further he was hitting, it was 140 yards. Fit him into it, got him in the found the right shaft, and then I tweaked his loss on all his clubs, and he went from an apex of like 60 feet to almost 100 feet, and he went from an eight-iron at 140 to an eight-iron at 175.

SPEAKER_03 58:52

Holy smokes.

SPEAKER_02 58:54

Yeah, that'll work. Because now, yeah, and that's the thing, it was literally all just because I got to where his ball went up in the air and it didn't have a ton of spin on it, and he absolutely loves him. And seeing the joy out of someone when you have someone that loves the game like he did, to be able to actually do what they want with the golf ball. Because he's like, now I'm hitting it in the greens and it's stopping. He's like, I'm not having to worry about it running a million miles past. He's like doing 100 feet. Yeah, he's like, This is awesome. He's like, I love this. And seeing the joy that they get out of that is that is what I really enjoy. Yeah. That's why and I I get that when with wedges and teaching people how to hit different wedge shots because they'll hit that one that it was exactly what they're looking for. And it's like, oh, okay, that's that's what we wanted to happen, and that's what it did.

SPEAKER_03 59:53

Well, I look forward to experiencing that feeling of uh sitting down with you and and getting getting fit into these new levels and hitting an eight-iron 175 yards.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:03

That would be No, I don't know about that. I don't know about that.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:08

Uh that feels like a personal shot if you don't think I can do that, but that's fine. I'm I'm I've got thick skin.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:14

Um I mean, I'll I'll give you a 790 and turn it down to a six iron, and then I think we gotta jump. Okay. Yeah, that'll yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:25

Um, so you're gonna be over there for uh until what, May, you said?

SPEAKER_02 1:00:30

No, I will be back in the States. I get back in March 7th. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:36

But then go, oh, go back in May and are there from May till September? Yes. Okay. And then when so last year it was a blast keeping up with you when you were qualifying for the open championship, made it to what, the final stages of qualifying there? Um when will that occur? And is there any status given to what you're doing right now on the Nordic tour that helps with that, or is that the same kind of same process this year?

SPEAKER_02 1:01:01

I don't know. I think it would be somewhat of a similar process. The only so with the with the Nordic with the Nordic golf league, I will have they get world ranking points. So granted, if I play well leading up to the open qualifier, if I and I don't know what the number is, but like if I'm able to get like my world ranking to a certain point, which I don't think I could on that tour anyways, unless like I I just won. Yeah, just blitz the whole place. Yeah. Now I will say one thing that I found out actually that's really nice about this tour, and it's very similar to what the Corn Ferry does as well, is the Nordic Golf League, if you win three events in a season, you automatically have the opportunity to get promoted to the hotel planner. That's so like if you let's say a guy comes out and wins the first three events of the season, he can go play the hotel planner like soon after that, from my understanding.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:09

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:10

So which they do the same thing kind of with Corn Ferry, where if you win three three times in a season on hotel planner, you can go to the DP as well.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:18

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:18

That's that's kind of that's really cool. That's a fast track. Yeah. Yeah, that's that's a very fast track. But I I think with the open qualifying, I'm gonna have to go back through the same process through both stages, which I will also have the US open qualifiers as well, that I would have to go kind of the same process as well.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:38

And are you gonna do that?

SPEAKER_02 1:02:40

I am. Um, I'm trying to figure out how I'm going to do it. Yeah, but the timeline of this doesn't work out great. And that's where it's like I'll be I'll be in Florida for the first round of it, and then I would leave like a day or two later. They have a site that I could play the second round of open of US Open qualifying in England. That's oh, that's right.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:11

Because I feel like Ian Poulter qualified has qualified before or something. I remember seeing this.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:16

Yeah, there's been guys from over there that's qualif over here that's qualified for it through that route. You there? Okay. Sorry, it said it was reconnecting for some reason.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:27

Yeah, I'm back. Yeah, like Ian Poulter, like it's like Woburn Golf Club or something, maybe has hosted one before or something.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:35

Maybe not remember. And I I can't remember what one it was because I remember seeing it on the list, and I almost put it on one of my options to pick, but I hadn't played, I don't think I had played a tournament here yet. So I didn't know what was going on. So I just kind of went with if I was in the States, I'd want to play at Springfield Country Club in Ohio. So I played there for the second round of it once before, and it it's a golf course that would really fit my game. Um it didn't that day, but it um it you don't have to hit it far out there. You just you have to be a ball striker, you have to hit it to the right places off the tee and avoid certain areas on the green. Because like the first green, if that goes Springfield and then Brookside? No, so Springfield Country Club, you play it twice in the same day. Okay. But it it's an overflow site for the one that they do play in Columbus that there have been four courses that they've kind of rotated in the past. Okay. Between it's what, Kensale, Ohio State Scarlet, um, Brookside in Columbus, and then Soyota in Columbus. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Those are like the four because they used to do the lakes, but the guys started tearing up the lakes golf course and going really low on it that they I think they still they might have played there a couple years ago, but they there's like a rotation of four or five golf courses that they play in Columbus because it's it's the Monday after the Memorial tournament. So that's why that one, that one's usually the first one to fill up because all the PGA guys are exempt to play, the guys that are exempt to play in sectionals sign up for that. And then you also have everybody wants to go to that one that plays in it, especially on the East Coast, because they take more from that site than anywhere.

SPEAKER_03 1:05:39

Oh, okay. Makes sense.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:41

So it's but I might I might reach out to the USGA about possibly changing my site to London and see if I would be allowed to. Um, even though I've already registered, I doubt they're gonna let me, but I also have to get through the first round of it in Tampa.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:00

Okay. And where will that be played? Uh signed up for Avala. Okay. I'm not familiar with that one. Where's that?

SPEAKER_02 1:06:10

It's um it's in Loot, Florida. It's right there in Tampa. It's uh close to USF. It's probably like a 15-minute drive from US, USF campus. It's they redid it a couple years ago. It's a great golf course. It's kind of your somewhat stereotypical Florida golf course. Not a ton of bunkers, though. But a lot of water. Very tree-lined and a lot of water. Um but I mean their greens are always firm, they're always fast, and they're always true. So, like most of the guys that have status in the Tampa area with Cornferry or your higher level tours, that's where they base out of. Okay. Good to know. So very, very nice club. So I'll have to when you come down to build your irons off to try to get you off there.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:06

That'd be a blast. Yeah, I want to play all your places down there. What's w I need to see Southern Hills, we go to Avala, we can try and get on Pelican Club. Um Um well, I know you have uh some rest you want to get before you have to get ready for uh more golf. Um, and you have a lot better things to do than stand on a stay on a podcast recording with me, but I do have a couple questions for you. Um a a dream three-hole composite. If you could pick any three holes and put them together, what would your three favorite holes be? Oh, that's tough.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:40

That's why I like that question. Yeah, that's tough. I mean, honestly, probably 13 at Augusta. Either 12 or 13 at Augusta. Uh I'm trying to think what the other ones would be. Uh probably 17 hit the old course. Okay. Um just because honestly, hitting over the hotel sign is that is a really really interesting feeling. Um and then I'm trying to think what the other one would be. I don't know. Cause I had 18 at Pebble, maybe, but honestly, if it if it could be oh, what's the hole at the waste management? Oh, 16? If it could be 16 with the crowd, yes. 100%.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:28

Oh, I like that. I like the little caveat with the crowd, with the stands, yeah, on a Saturday, everybody's three sheets still in.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:35

Exactly. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:37

Uh so you have competed in a lot of professional golf. I mean, you're doing that right now while you're across the pond. If you could change one rule, what would that rule be?

SPEAKER_02 1:08:47

I don't know. That's a tough one. Because I I don't know. That's tough because play it as it lies is the oldest outstanding rule in golf. And yes, that should be played, but also hitting it into the middle of the fairway and being in a divot. I mean, yeah, that it's kind of bullshit. But I also I wouldn't change it because it's the oldest standing rule in the game of golf. Yeah. The one rule that I would like to add for tournament golf only, but it you could never add it, would be the spectator rule.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:27

Where like for instance the ball?

SPEAKER_02 1:09:31

Yes. Because like if you hit it, because some of the courses you play, especially if you get more up north where they have longer rough with the bent grass and that, you can hit a ball five yards off the fairway, and there's another 15 yards right of that before it's even close to being lost. And you can't find it because it's just too thick to find it. Granted, I know you go with the rule, you shouldn't hit it there anyways. Right. But at the same time, it it's like if there was a spectator over here, they could literally point you right to where the ball is.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:04

Yeah, yeah. It probably hit them. And I'm with you on the on the first one you mentioned again, like, well, this is where you're supposed to hit it, to your point just now. And if it's in the fairway and in a divot, like, come on. Like uh, and and it that punishes the guys that are in the lead because they're the ones who have had to, they're playing behind everybody else. And it just uh yeah, if you hit it where you're supposed to hit it and it ends up in a divot, and I know, well, what is a how you how do you define a divot? And I get that. Like I've got an idea of trying to make uh use a different color sand for tournament weeks. That way, if it's if it's sanded, and then you gotta, okay, well, is are there grains of sand touching it? Well, I mean, but it's also a sport that polices itself. And so I I think there's because you have that element to it of guys calling penalties on themselves, unless you're Patrick Reed, and things like that, the the gentlemanliness of the game, I think, would prevail. But man, just seeing guys get absolutely hosed because they hit it where you're supposed to hit it frustrates me.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:07

Yeah. But honestly, a massive step when they said you could fix anything on the greens. Yeah. That was a that was a huge rule change. Um, if and granted, like as far as being able to take relief out of a divot out of the fairway, I I understand everybody's argument and I completely get it, and I've been screwed by it. But like I say, it's the oldest standing rule in golf. The one I would love for them to change would let people anchor putters again. Get rid of arm lock. Okay. You would like to be putter. I would like to let people anchor again. Because when you anchor, you can still actually twist the putter. Okay. You can still manipulate the face. Where with armlock, the way that has gotten now, there's essentially no manipulating the face on that putter.

SPEAKER_03 1:11:56

Okay, so you would remove it would allow the anchor.

SPEAKER_04 1:12:00

Yes. Okay, I like that. Yeah.

unknown 1:12:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:06

Especially like if you think of like belly putters, you can you're using your hands and your wrist. It's real easy to, oh, oh, I pulled that one or I pushed that one. You can still rotate the face. Where with an arm lock, it's you can rotate the face with an arm lock, but it's a lot more effort to actually rotate the face with an arm lock.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:28

To do it. Okay. Yeah, I'm I dig that. I like it. That's a good, that's a good rule change. I I know Bernhard Longer and Akshay Batia would be fully on board for it. Yeah. Yes, they would.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:41

And Tim Clark would have a career again.

unknown 1:12:44

Right, right.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:45

Uh well, last question, and we'll get you out of here. Uh, do you or don't you hit it off the deck? And if so, why or why not?

SPEAKER_02 1:12:51

I do a lot. Um if there is trouble left, I will hit, especially on par fives, I will hit driver off the deck any day of the week. Because I know when I hit it off the deck, that ball's going right, and I can aim at the trouble and know it's gonna fade back in.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:10

I love that. I love that. I know there's trouble left, so I'm hitting it off the deck because it's going right.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:16

Yep. I and when you come down and play, when you come to Florida, we'll play Southern, and number seven is a par five that it goes up the hill and then it makes a hard turn and drops straight down the hill. And from the top of the hill to the bottom of the hill to where the green is, it's it, I would say a 60-foot elevation change. Um I mean, it plays down, I think it's from the top of the hill, I think it plays down 25 yards. There is a long bunker that runs up the right side of the hole that if you get it just a little too far right in the fairway, it will kick down into it. I have hit driver out of that bunker multiple times and it drives people nuts.

SPEAKER_03 1:14:02

That you're hitting driver out of the bunker.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:04

That might be a new one out of the bunker, because essentially it goes from where it ends up in the bunker to the trees across the fairway where it makes the dog leg is 200 yards. Okay. So I hit this hard, massive slack cut that goes straight at those trees and makes a right hand turn and runs straight down the hill. It just catches the slope and runs for days. Oh, yeah. Cause I mean I've hit that, I've hit out of that bunker before like that and had 30 yards into the green. Oh, that's awesome. It's a par five.

SPEAKER_03 1:14:35

Right. That's fantastic. Well, we are all pulling for you over here. Uh, and I very much appreciate you taking time to come on the show. Tell Connor we said hello. Uh we uh I know he's your your buddy over there. I'm glad you have a traveling companion. Um, but it was great getting to meet him uh this past December at Sweeton's. Um but wish you all the best. Hope I get to see you sooner rather than later. Um, and we'll be pulling for you.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:01

Thank you. Thank you. I appreciate all that. And it it's good having him over here. He uh he helps keep me in the right mindset and get out of my own way. And kind of where you were talking about the grind and that and everything that we're on. He's like, look, you've made it. He's like, this is what we all dream of as a kid. He's like, you're teeing it up for a check. Yeah. You are a pro. He's like, you're there. Now just have fun and enjoy it. Yeah. And he constantly reminds me of that. And it's it's been great having him over here. He's been a tremendous help, and he's he's done very well and kept me out of my own way. Good. Good. So we we love that. Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Well, thank by the way, thank you for the video too. I appreciate that.

SPEAKER_03 1:15:49

Absolutely. I had fun making it. Fun, fun finding old clips of you and and putting together a little hype video to to send you off as you were boarding that uh looked like you were in the front of the plane on that on that trip over, so you were traveling in comfort, which was nice.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:06

Yeah, we uh we had a good little points upgrade.

SPEAKER_03 1:16:09

Yeah, that was that that is you you landed and you were rested, I'm sure. Yeah. Uh and and maybe slightly inebriated.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:16

No, I actually didn't drink.

SPEAKER_03 1:16:18

Oh, nice.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:19

I'd have probably slept better.

SPEAKER_03 1:16:23

Uh, like I said, we'll be pulling for you. Um, wish you nothing but the best. Hug Connor's neck for us, and uh, and we'll see you soon.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:30

Sounds good.

SPEAKER_03 1:16:31

Thank you, Josh. See ya. Yeah, absolutely. For Will Robbins, I'm Josh Decker, and this has been another episode of Off the Deck.