Off the Deck
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Off the Deck
Golf History with John Morton
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John Morton knows golf history, and how to plan a great golf trip.
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Driver off the deck for Corey Connor. Here's driver off the deck. Victor Hoblin. So the driver off the deck. I knew you would try this, right?
SPEAKER_01Oh my just to be able to hit it off the deck and get that thing down and fly it in running.
SPEAKER_02You have to put your foot on the gas. You pull out the driver off the deck and you put it on the green all the way up the hill.
unknownDon't stop, don't stop. Yes, so it's back again.
SPEAKER_01Welcome into another episode of Off the Deck. My name is Josh Decker. Off the deck is brought to you by Idaca Golf. It is still Capri Polo season here in Birmingham, as much as I would like for it to be hoodie season. So rocking a Capri Polo again today. Love the feel, fit of these shirts. Make sure you use promo code OTD25 at checkout. That's going to save you 25%. I do know they've got some fun stuff coming, some new releases. Uh, and though that promo code will also be eligible on all of their new products. So again, this isn't just saving you 5% or 10%. It is a full-on 25%. Uh and y'all have heard me rave about their golf glove as well. So check out iDa.gov there. Uh Mr. John Morton, welcome to Off the Deck. I appreciate it. Thanks for having me, Josh. Yeah, yeah. Excited to chat about you, uh, your background, uh, your recent trip to Scotland, which looks absolutely incredible from all the pictures uh and all the content you shared there on your Twitter, I guess, X account now. Um, but let's dive right in. Uh, you have the letters PGA behind your background or behind your last name. So, what is your history with the game? When were you introduced to the game? Uh let's let's talk early life of John Morton.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so I I I've been playing golf ever since I was a little kid. I I think my dad first introduced me to the game when I was maybe eight or nine, give or take. Um, and and it just it just got a hold on me and and stuck. Um, so been playing ever since I was a little kid through, you know, junior golf leagues. Uh I was born and raised in the Philadelphia area, so up in the Northeast. Uh so playing junior golf leagues as a as a as a youngster, and then eventually played through high school. And um going through high school is really where you know I started to have some summer jobs and and uh in-school jobs uh at local golf courses. Uh that really helped kind of open my eyes to the business game of of golf, uh, or the business of golf, I should say. So once that got once I got exposed to that, uh then I started to explore, you know, how can how can I turn this into a job? Because I I I love the game that much. Uh eventually went away to college in North Carolina, went to Methodist University uh specifically for their professional golf management program, uh, to be able to learn the ins and outs of how to be a club professional, an actual PGA golf professional. So went through that program, did a variety of internships around the country, uh, eventually graduated uh with a you know full bachelor's degree in business and with my PGA membership. Uh so uh it was a great way to be able to dive into the industry.
SPEAKER_01Uh so we've had Kevin Quinn on the show. Uh he's a club professional head pro over at Vestavia Country Club here in Birmingham. And his internship list included Sleepy Hollow, Quaker Ridge, uh, and I think Southern Hills, maybe. Uh did you get to intern anywhere uh as exclusive or as extravagant as any of those?
SPEAKER_00Uh uh I I did. Uh and and coincidentally enough, I have worked at Vestavia Country Club in the past. That was the last uh uh golf course that I was a PGA professional at before I left the industry a few years ago from a club professional standpoint. Uh but I was I was actually an assistant professional, uh an interim head golf professional at Vestavia uh almost a decade ago now. It's been a been a while, but uh small world and know the course well. Um uh but uh yeah, so I I was fortunate to have some really great internships uh at places like Pinehurst Resort, uh TPC Sawgrass, uh as well as the Broadmoor uh resort out in Colorado Springs, Colorado. Uh so uh yeah, was very fortunate to uh see some really great places and have have some decent courses to play some golf at when I wasn't working.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that's not that's not bad at all. So both of those, or two of the venues that you mentioned, and I think I think the Broadmoor hosts an event as well. But Pinehurst and TPC Saugrass, TPC, of course, hosts the players every year. Were you there when Pinehurst hosted a U.S. Open?
SPEAKER_00Uh I was not. I was there uh a year that Pine Needles, just down the road, hosted a U.S. women's open. Um and traditionally or typically when the U.S. Women's Open comes to Pine Needles, the Pinehurst resort uh merchandising team and staff helps the USGA with coordination and planning and buying for all the merchandise operations for the U.S. Women's Open. So part of my internship actually involved assisting with logistics for the U.S. Women's Open, which is pretty cool.
SPEAKER_01And what was Sawgrass like for the play of the players as an intern?
SPEAKER_00That was that was a really, really unique experience because I started the job three weeks before the players that that year. It was back in 2008. Uh, so it was the year that Sergio won for any uh any players' uh history aficionados. Um but yeah, uh got got thrown right into the fire uh starting work uh just a couple weeks before the players. Players was an incredible experience, and then had the the rest of the summer with just regular daily operations and and resort operations uh for the property. So it was a neat kind of mixed bag experience there.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, thrown right to the fire. I mean that and that's not a small tournament either.
SPEAKER_00Like it's it is not, it is not in in any way, shape, or form, um, let alone somebody who's trying to learn the property for the first time.
SPEAKER_01Right, right. Yeah, you're trying to figure out how to get from hole three to hole seven in the blink of an eye. And yeah, that's that's wild. Right, right, right. Uh so so what was it? Um and if you don't want to go into detail, I certainly understand. I'm always fascinated uh because working as a a PJ professional is uh is very challenging. It is long days, long hours. If you're at a private club, you have anywhere between six to eight hundred bosses that you report to. What was it that ultimately drove you into a different profession?
SPEAKER_00Uh that that is a great question and totally fair question. Um and it was it was a combination of a couple different things. Uh firstly, um the the the industry is it is very difficult being a PGA professional just from a work-life balance standpoint. And I know that phrase, that that buzz phrase is is very cliche at this point to the point of being overused. But as a as a golf professional, as a club professional, um uh regardless of whether you're at a public facility, a resort facility, or a private facility that has a membership, there there's a lot of time demands that people don't realize that make it really difficult to have a life outside of golf. So, you know, when I'm in my early and mid-20s, uh, you know, in single, I don't mind being at the golf course all day, every day. Right. Uh because, you know, when I can sneak away and play nine holes or play with a group of members or go hit some balls or teach a lesson, make a few extra bucks, I'm all for it. But come time to get married and uh still spending 70 hours a week at the golf course, um, not super helpful or conducive to uh, you know, a young marriage, uh essentially, an early marriage. So uh I I didn't get married, my wife and I didn't get married until we were 27, almost 28. Uh, but uh it was just very difficult to be in an industry like that that quite frankly, uh just my personal opinion, but in an industry where people talk about valuing PGA professionals, but they don't back that up with the financial uh investment to help keep PGA professionals at you know in the game and at the clubs. Uh so it's a it's an industry that sees a lot of movement. It's an industry that sees you know golf pros move from club to club, state to state, you know, time zone to time zone, uh very frequently because the pay isn't uh the isn't all that great to be quite honest. So it was a variety of factors from a time standpoint, from a financial standpoint, from a work-life balance standpoint. Um and and at that point in my life, in my career, I had very much grown to actually resent the game of golf uh for a variety of other reasons, in addition to those. So it it was it was the right time for me to to leave the game and and you know explore a different career path. That thankfully I'm still on that career path. Um I'm back involved in the game in a different way now, uh as we'll get into. But um it it was it was the right time for me to to take a different direction.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and that takes uh kind of a uh a hearty level of self-reflection, right? Of like, you know what, I've uh I I went to school for this and I love this game, but this it in it right now. Like I can totally see that. Like I mean, but to to do something and and then losing the joy in the game also is kind of what sounds like what you were saying. Like, then it's like and not everybody can love their job, right? Like I we have nine to fives and that's what they are. Um, but uh especially if it's taking a hobby or something that you genuinely cared for as an extracurricular activity and turned it into probably what sounds like more maybe more of a task as opposed to something you enjoyed. Like, yeah, I can see how that would just grind on you day after day.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it uh there's definitely that that's a a very, very good point. And that that resentment definitely grows the the more that your value as you know a professional, as a member of the team isn't recognized and doesn't continue to grow. Yeah. Um so it's it can be difficult and and to the self-reflection point, there were there were a lot of friends and family that that really discouraged me from going down this other career path that I wanted to explore. Uh, and I want to, you know, a completely different career path for for the job that I was uh you know gonna take, including, you know, my parents and immediate family that that said, this is this is not you. Why are you gonna do this? And it was people that that didn't see you know the daily life and the daily grind uh of the last few years of my time as a club professional and and the the challenges that came with that. So uh at the end of the day, uh I I needed to trust myself, I needed to trust my wife. My wife supported me in in that decision to to go down a different path. And uh thankfully it was definitely the right one for us.
SPEAKER_01Great. Well, yeah, and and family doesn't see you managing the T-sheet at seven o'clock every Saturday and Sunday for the entire summer. Like that's that's gotta that's gotta suck sometimes, I'm sure.
SPEAKER_00Exactly. Exactly. And and not to say that that every club uh you know doesn't appreciate their staffs. Obviously, there are many, there are countless uh, you know, public, resort, and private facilities uh across the country, around the world that highly value their their golf professional staffs, but it's the ones that that that are more combative, uh that make it really challenging to be an assistant professional or a first assistant professional and work your way up having to bounce around to so many different places before finding what could be that long-term job. Um, so it's just a a challenging industry to be a part of, uh, but but one that um I I take a lot of extra time now anytime I go to a golf course to to seek out the the golf professionals and let them know how much their their efforts and their job is is appreciated by by me and my wife and anybody else that we happen to be with.
SPEAKER_01So it sounds like the joy the joy is back.
SPEAKER_00The joy is very much back. Uh it's it took a couple of years, honestly. It was probably I think the first year after I left the golf industry, I didn't play golf once. Like we literally never touched my clubs. Whereas when I was a club professional, I played five, six days a week.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00So to go from one extreme to the other, it was very drastic. Um, but definitely have have fallen in love with the game again. Uh my wife and I have have started to play together a lot more. Uh you know, I'll touch on her background in a second, but we played a lot early in our relationship. Golf is how we met. Uh, but that obviously that love for me went away, but it's it's definitely come back for both of us and and for me in a variety of different ways, actually.
SPEAKER_01That's that's fantastic. So you you mentioned your wife and and you posted something uh I guess it was a week or so ago. Um you posted both of your handicaps. Um and I mean I'm I'm always browsing X and seeing what's on Twitter, and uh, of course I follow you. And I clicked on that image and I like I think I audibly went, whoa, because she's is she a plus 2.6, I think. Is that right? Or somewhere in that ranking?
SPEAKER_00I mean it's uh it's either plus 2.3 or plus 2.6, and that's actually pretty low compared to what it was last year. I think she I think she dropped as as low as plus three point four at one point last year in 2025. Um what's her background?
SPEAKER_01She just played collegiately and then had to have played some some level of professionally, I would assume. She she did, yeah.
SPEAKER_00She played all through high school, played uh Division I golf uh at uh you'll you'll get this reference uh at Birmingham Southern uh college in Birmingham, the the school that a couple of years ago very famously, you know, uh dissolved. Um so she played at Birmingham Southern uh a while ago, and then uh after she graduated, she played many tours uh for a number of years, futures tours and Symmetra, it was called at the time. And then she did have uh she did get through uh all the stages of Q school uh and had status on the LPGA for a year as well.
SPEAKER_01That's fantastic. So so y'all have your love for one another and also love the game, and then uh you're probably still on a high from the trip to Scotland. Um very much so. Yeah, and and all the images you shared, that's one of the reasons I wanted to chat because I was seeing all that. I was like, man, I was like, I just want to hear about this. So I've yet to make that trip. How and and some of this you've shared, uh, which your your Twitter account or X account is a treasure trove of golf content. So I highly suggest uh everyone checking out John Morton's Twitter account. But what how far in advance did you book this trip? I'd love to hear some of the details. As someone who's never been, and I'm sure we have plenty of listeners who have never made the trek to the home of golf. Uh, how far out are you working on logistics and trying to get this coordinated?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so I I appreciate the kind words. And uh yeah, we had an absolute blast over there. Uh my wife Jordan and I went over with two of our close friends, uh Russ and Carrie, that we play a lot of golf with. Um we uh we went over for a little over a week. It was about nine days, uh, and uh and then they actually flew home and I stayed for another week, which was pretty unique and and pretty cool. Um But we had started planning, this was uh two weeks ago, a little over two weeks ago. So it was the end of July, early into early August that we were there. Um we started planning this trip at the end of last August, 2025. Uh so great timing for us to have this chat here at the end of August in 2026. Uh, because the end of August, usually around Labor Day, give or take uh a few days, give or take a week or so, is when the St. Andrews Links Trust opens up the annual ballot for tea times on the old course for the entire upcoming calendar year. So at some point in the next 10 to 14 days, uh St. Andrews will start to send emails out, they'll start posting on social media, they'll start posting on their website uh that applications are being accepted for tea time requests for the old course throughout the entire 2027 calendar year. So last August we filled out our ballot application uh me and Jordan did for us and our friends Russ and Carrie without telling them. And that's cool. We we were notified about a month later, so it's usually the end of September, early October, uh, that we had been selected for a tea time. Uh so it's actually a two-round package. You get one round at the old course, one round at another course in St. Andrews, uh, and then some food and beverage and and merchandise and you know, range balls uh type type package. Uh so we got notified that we got that tea time, and and from that uh week, uh when we went and had dinner with Russ and Carrie to surprise them and tell them, hey, do you want to go to Scotland? Uh we've got a guarantee. Yeah. Uh which they were ecstatic about and immediately on board. Um so once once we once we had that dinner, uh, Russ and I started going heavy into planning. Um Jordan and I have been fortunate to to go to Scotland a number of times in in recent years. So I I planned it all, coordinated it all, uh, but Russ helped kind of uh point point a few things and and and asked for for a few things to be incorporated into the trip. So uh yeah, we ended up going over, had an absolute, absolute blast. Uh it was, I think, nine rounds of golf in eight days. So so it's interesting.
SPEAKER_01Uh uh most people I hear that go over there go over there already uh uh with an itinerary, and then they do the lottery, get up at 2 a.m. go stand in line to try and get on at the old course. It sounds like your trip was kind of the inverse of that. You entered the lottery or the and and got in and then built your trip off of that. Is that a fair assessment?
SPEAKER_00That is spot on. And and we were very fortunate to hit the ballot for the old course. And then from there we knew the day that our old course round was gonna happen. Okay, and we built the rest of the trip literally around that. So we arrived, we flew out on Saturday, arrived in Edinburgh Sunday morning, played golf Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday was our round on the old course, played more golf Thursday, Friday, Saturday, and then they flew home Sunday. So the old course was literally right in the middle of the trip, but we built the other tea times around that one day and that one round.
SPEAKER_01So, where else did you play other than the old course and the new course while y'all were all together? Because I know you had an experience that we will touch on uh that was a bucket list day for you uh after after everyone departs and comes back home. Yes but where where all did y'all play as as a group?
SPEAKER_00So our our trip was split into two halves. The first half was up in uh Fife, which is where St. Andrews is, the county that St. Andrews is located in. And then the second half was out in East Lothian, uh, towards Gaulland and North Barrack area. Uh so we arrived on Sunday. Uh Sunday was basically just a throwaway day. We went and did some sightseeing in the city, and that was pretty much it. Just get over jet lag type day. Yeah. But um uh Monday and Tuesday were rounds at Crail Balcomi, which is a course about 10, 15 minutes from St. Andrews, and then Tuesday was around at the new course, which was basically kind of it can be thought of as as a warm-up for us before our big round on the old course on Wednesday. Okay. And how were your conditions? Um weather was was very, very pleasant for us all three of those days. Uh, Crail, absolutely perfect, sunny, maybe 65 degrees, a little bit of a breeze by Scottish standards, so maybe 15 miles an hour. Um so not that bad, uh, but very pleasant day. New course, very similar day, but a little bit breezier, maybe 20 to 25 mile an hour winds. Uh, but again, sunny 60, 65 degrees, perfect temperature. The old course we had sunny and slightly overcast, perfect weather for the first 14 holes. Okay, and then it decided to uh give us a light rain at really wasn't that heavy uh and it didn't uh it wasn't a ton of wind, but a light rain coming in from fifteen through eighteen. So the iconic holes we had a an extra uh an extra gift from the the Scottish golf gods uh of a little bit of rain to to help help uh have some extra fun playing you know the road hole and coming up over the swoking bridge etc right and did I see that you you all had a photographer with you we did yeah good good friend of mine that I've gotten to know over the last few years uh guy by the name of Ryan Cavan he's actually a professional golf photographer so he specializes in following a group of golfers like us and taking candid shots of us throughout the round essentially so that on a bucket list round of golf like that at the old course we're not having to scramble constantly going, oh well let me get a picture you know Jordan of you hitting this shot or let me get a picture of of this here let me get a picture of that there we can actually enjoy the experience and it makes such such a tremendous difference in the overall day in the overall experience of the round. So um I Ryan has been uh has uh photographed me and and a couple different rounds that me and Jordan have have had over the past few years. So I uh hired him to come tag along for our round at the old course it was a surprise for Russ and Carrie we didn't tell them until that morning uh so it helped kind of alleviate that extra layer of kind of stress and pressure of constantly feeling like you have to have your phone in your hand to make the memories or recall the memories at a later date.
SPEAKER_01Yeah and I guess he's just kind of following behind and he knows kind of the cadence of the game and so if he's a professional photographer or professional golf photographer like you said it's second nature for him to see where your lie is and figure out the best angle and I bet he shoots the old course 300 times a year. So he probably knows I bet your imagery from that is incredible.
SPEAKER_00It it really is. The way he's able to frame different shots at different angles uh it's absolutely phenomenal. Um I mean everything from making sure that you know the photo that he gets of me after I miss my birdie putt on the 18th hole with the RNA clubhouse perfectly framed as the backdrop, which is you know side note that was one of my favorite photos because I slumped my body over uh because my birdie putt, you know, hung up on the lip but framing something like that to a shot on the back nine that my wife had on a downslope just over a bunker and he's laying on his side sliding down this hill you know that that's filled with fescue so he can get the perfect angle from you know low to the ground of my wife you know after she makes contact with the ball. Thinking through all of that, it makes such a big difference to the overall experience when a day or two after your round you get an email to uh you know with a link to a website that has 200 photographs of you and your group from the most memorable round of golf you might ever play in your life. It's it's such a tremendous way. Ryan does such a great job with it.
SPEAKER_01That's incredible. I need to have him on the show. I'd I'd love to just hear him tell stories because I bet he has seen some wild stuff happen on a golf course.
SPEAKER_00Absolutely absolutely I'm I'm sure he would love to to join uh join an episode with you.
SPEAKER_01Uh so your wife Jordan and then apparently y'all are incredible people to be friends with um because you surprised friends with a trip to the old course and oh by the way we've heard a photographer um so I so my wife and I need to get to know the Mortons better. Um you then have a bucket list day um and you tweeted about this you're like yeah it's not just a bucket list it is like the bucket list. Um where did you get to play? And I want to hear kind of from a rival your highlights uh let's let's hear about that day.
SPEAKER_00Yeah so as I as I alluded to earlier um Russ and Carrie and my wife uh were over there for a little over a week with me and then I put the three of them on on a plane home uh on Sunday and uh I had a a few extra things lined up for myself including uh a couple rounds of golf uh throughout that following week so uh put them on a plane on Sunday uh was kind enough to be hosted Sunday afternoon by uh a friend of mine actually that I've gotten to know through uh through X or through Twitter uh a gentleman named Graham Renton uh hosted me at his course Levin Links which is basically in between Edinburgh and um and St. Andrews. So I had a great time playing with him and his son Ewan Monday and Tuesday uh I had or Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday I had um a couple other just meetings lined up with some some uh fellow historians and and other friends in St. Andrews area uh as well as up in uh Aberdeen and then uh capped off the trip the very final day for me that Thursday uh before I flew home on Friday with a round at Muirfield. Um so I had secured this tea time at Muirfield almost a year and a half ago uh it was in April of 2025 when the tea sheet for Muirfield for the entire calendar year of 2026 opened up and I was fortunate to get a single tea time uh just for 18 holes which I'll explain that in a second uh at Muirfield uh for me and then I was gonna gonna host and and actually um take care of uh three good friends of mine uh to be able to to play around to golf together other fellow historians so uh we had an unbelievable experience there at Muirfield playing 18 holes and then afterwards we had we we took part in their their legendary lunch there in the the great room of the clubhouse and and you you posted a picture of the gate to walk through um and and you also talked about that you guys went in and showered and and then full suits um I mean as traditional as I can think of or at least that I'm familiar with of an experience um so if you already had this back in April uh was it just purely coincidental that the ballot you all got drawn for for the old course happened to align? Um not really no when you what when you fill out the ballot that's a great question when you fill out the ballot uh for the annual ballot for the old course um you're allowed to to put up to I think it's either two or three like 10-day windows okay that you'd like you know uh a tea time to to be within um so I basically put the front end ahead of the Muirfield tea time as one of those windows and the back end as the other window uh knowing that if we landed the old course it would work out perfect. Yeah if we didn't I'd still just build a trip around the Muirfield tea time instead. So thankfully it was it was on the front end uh and and close enough. If it was a little bit closer uh you know Russ and Carrie and my wife would have stayed but it it ended up being a little bit too awkward of of timing being you know almost two weeks or you know kind of a week and a half essentially in between them. But yeah you you essentially pick or choose uh a date window for the old course tea time.
SPEAKER_01So so what was the situation with only I mean you said only 18 and I'm like it's 18 holes it's Muirfield that sounds incredible. Is it customary for a tea time to have a loop in the morning and then another loop or is it what was just the 18 that you were referring to?
SPEAKER_00Yeah what what you just said is the case it's it's customary it's it's most known Muirfield is for their 36 whole day experience. So uh you book a a foursome you play 18 holes in the morning everybody plays their own ball you go into the clubhouse after the first round everybody showers gets into suits and ties because that's required uh for their dining room you sit down you take part in this just very lavish buffet lunch and then you change right back into golf clothes and you go out and you play an alternate shot round in the afternoon. Okay. So it's a very famous experience to have both rounds both morning and afternoon with the lunch in between um but what most people don't know is that Muirfield does have a small allotment of 18 hole tea times that are not 36 holes that are late morning on their visitor days. So visitors are only allowed on Tuesdays and Thursdays or their guest days essentially um and the 36 hole tea times are usually between roughly 8 and 10 a.m and then like 1 and 3 p.m with the lunch from like 12 to 1 essentially or 12 to 2. So they have a block of tea times essentially between 10 and 12 a.m that are just for 18 holes. So I was able to secure one of those tea times which honestly I think worked out better for our group I don't I actually I haven't said this out loud so for anybody that watches this feel free to crucify me but I'll stand by this until the day I die I'm glad I didn't have a second round at Mirrorfield because our group had our 18 whole round where we played our own ball. So it was an alternate shot we played our own ball. We had an unbelievable experience then our group it was me and again three close friends who were all you know fellow golf historians we went in got changed into our suits sat down our lunch probably took two hours and then we spent another hour or two between the four of us walking around the clubhouse just admiring all the artifacts and memorabilia and talking about different aspects of the history of the club and what they have on their walls. So our group appreciated the extra time and not having to rush out of lunch to go play another round of golf. So for that reason I say I wouldn't have wanted a second round of golf. I probably wouldn't have played a second round of golf if they offered it to me because that extra time in the clubhouse meant more to me and the group that I was playing with than another round of golf would have so if you had to choose one experience in Scotland if it was Muirfield or the old course which one would you choose oh oh oh oh um I can't choose that uh yeah I don't I don't know if I could choose that to to be honest um choose one over the other uh both are are very unique um inevitably my mind would lean more towards the old course just from the standpoint of with all due respect to Muirfield their golf course is 125 years old the history of the club and the honorable company of Edinburgh golfers and the experience of the clubhouse and the traditions of the club is what makes Muirfield a cool experience which is unbelievable. Yeah but for me the old course the golf is what takes precedence and what takes the spotlight and yeah you know a round of golf at the old course doesn't include being able to go in and have lunch in the RA, certainly but uh and it doesn't for anybody that may not have heard me correctly but uh the experience of playing the old course is it's it's goosebuminducing in in so many ways in so many moments throughout that type of round that I I think I'd have to choose I think I'd have to choose old the old course. Okay. Which I probably need it'd be a very difficult like one A, one B type tiebreaker.
unknownOkay.
SPEAKER_01And I probably needed to hear that because I've I've kind of the the old course I I don't know if it's maybe the experience you were just talking about because like what you described with Muirfield sounds absolutely incredible. Like I that that I feel like is an all-encompassing kind of day and the old course like you said you're not going to go in and sit down at the RNA and have lunch. So it feels like it's a different kind of experience to me. So that's why I had to pose that question because I'm just like well which which one if you had to pick one would it be so that's that's fascinating great answer.
SPEAKER_00Yeah they're they're definitely very different golf experiences. Not that either one is better or worse but they're just very different golf experiences. I mean you walking up the 18th hole of of the old course uh I mean for for anybody listening literally close your eyes right now and and picture the 18th fairway and picture yourself walking up the 18th fairway of the old course whether you've done it before or not now on any given day for every single group for any single group walking up the 18th fairway you're gonna have people that are just part of the general public standing behind the 18th green that will literally applaud a good shot for a stranger that will literally applaud somebody that makes a putt. So the experience of of that camaraderie and that community of the old course in the 18th hole not to mention the first T shot which is the most nerve wracking tee shot in golf um but that experience of community with the 18th green is is unlike anything I think anywhere else in the game of golf okay okay well now I'm now I'm back to the old course just have both in your trip that just have both I'll get with you after we record because I don't want you to to reveal any of your trade secrets.
SPEAKER_01So you you mentioned a trip to Aberdeen and that was one of the things I wanted to ask you about and and you have quite a collection at least best I can tell of golf artifacts and you returned an Aberdeen golf club playing jacket to Aberdeen was that something that was part of the trip you'd already planned did you reach out to Aberdeen and tell them you were doing this and like to expect you to show up with one of their jackets that was a hundred years old or how how did that dialogue transpire?
SPEAKER_00Yeah that was um that that was a a really special day uh uh albeit it was a rain soaked day we originally intended to play golf but it poured rain the whole day so that did not happen um but uh a mutual friend of mine and the the heritage committee and the archivist and historian at Royal Aberdeen put me in touch with them um uh a couple of months ago because he knew that I had this playing jacket that was from the 1870s, so about 150 years old, give or take. It's crazy. And it's a a bright red uh kind of heavy wool jacket uh that is very weather worn because it was an actual playing like golf jacket, golfing jacket that a member of Aberdeen golf club at the time that would eventually become Royal Aberdeen uh would have actually played golf with out in the elements. And the the reason that I point that out is members of clubs in the 1800s would have had two jackets when they became a member one as a dining jacket or a dinner jacket and the other as a playing jacket. The playing jacket was meant to be worn to make you recognizable to other members of the community when you were out on the links as hey, I'm a golfer so kind of essentially steer clear or watch out because you know errant golf shots could could come near you if you see that rip. But I had acquired that jacket a while back uh through an auction house and the mutual friend of ours put me in touch with the club because the club was interested in uh in adding it back to their their archives and their their displays and their collection. So they reached out to me I was able to to chat with them a little bit was able to to coordinate for a day for me and that mutual friend who happens to live in St. Andrews to make a trip up uh to to have lunch with them with the their their uh head of their heritage committee as well as their general manager uh with the full intention of you know us coming to some agreement uh you know for for that jacket to stay there, which we were able to to do thankfully but to your point I I I like to collect golf memorabilia and golf artifacts and golf history but specifically I like to collect items that have a story to them items that tell the history of the game more so with due respect than you know a single Tiger Woods trading card of which there might be you know a million of in the world. Being able to to own something that has a very unique story and ties to the early days of the game of golf just really speaks to to me and and and you know my love of the game. So I've owned that jacket for a while uh but I also am not one that collects to hoard I collect until something doesn't give me butterflies anymore you know in in in my chest when I look at it. And I also only collect until somewhere else that clearly is going to appreciate it more or someone else is going to appreciate it more than I do approaches me and says hey I'm interested in in acquiring this from you and that was very much the case here. I am all for in all scenarios items returning to its rightful home. And even though this jacket still gave me butterflies, make no mistake because it used to hang right there I'm pointing over my left shoulder for anybody not watching it used to hang right there in my office um it still gave me butterflies but when when the rightful home of something like that reaches out to you I I I I can't I can't in good conscience you know turn that down. I can't deny their desire to appreciate and share their club's history with the world with every visitor and member that ever steps foot in their clubhouse. So was was absolutely delighted to be able to bring that there uh you know for that lunch and then be able to to come to a little agreement I'll just put it that way politely uh for for that jacket to stay there because in their clubhouse they already had one of the dining jackets but they've never had a playing jacket before. Wow so this completes the pairing for them from that same era the the two jackets even had the same exact buttons um so it was really really special that's that's incredible that's especially uh there's a heightened level of that that you completed the the pairing like that's that it really is incredible um wow that had to be an awesome experience for you it it really was it really was um I mean we we were so I was so fortunate so so thankful that they they were nice enough to host us for lunch and we're we're willing to host us for golf even though it didn't happen. And and just you know two days after the the Scottish amateur uh was was completed there at Royal Aberdeen because that was played here the uh there this year um but so grateful that they uh that they were willing to host us uh host me my friend that day that we were able to to to make it work out uh for it to stay there and um that the the history is is now able to be shared with their their membership and and you know all visitors moving forward. Yeah wow so you you talk about the butterflies you get uh from certain artifacts and and pieces from golf history tell me about the butterflies from the golf ball made by Tom Morris yeah that's uh that those butterflies I don't feel like they're gonna go away for a long time um I uh for for those that don't know uh uh um amongst my collection uh of golf memorabilia some of which you can see on the walls behind me in my office that I'm still getting moved into from a recent move to Florida uh amongst my collection is uh a feathery golf ball that was made by old Tom Morris around 1848 to 1849 give or take a year or two um or give or take a year because I can be that specific um it would have been made between 1848 and 1850. So there's there's only five that I believe that are known to still exist that were made by old Tom Morris. Um so was fortunate to acquire that uh early Last year, um, earlier last summer, actually, uh, from an auction house in England. And then uh the story that that made made the rounds and and really went viral once I shared the story of the golf ball itself was that I didn't trust any shipping company to send something that fragile and delicate uh overseas from England all the way to where I lived in Birmingham, Alabama at the time. So I made the crazy decision after getting my wife's blessing to fly over to England, pick it up, and fly all the way back home in just about 24 hours. So it was a whirlwind trip to be able to ensure uh that that item was treated with the care that it needed to be, making the trip back across the Atlantic or making the trip across the Atlantic uh back home with me uh to become a permanent part of my collection.
SPEAKER_01I I love that you pointed out there that you got the blessing from Jordan to fly over there and get it and didn't talk about the blessing from Jordan to buy a hundred and seventy-six-year-old golf ball.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I I'm I'm I'm thankful that she uh very, very thank beyond grateful uh that she, for the most part, doesn't question when I buy things for for my collection anymore. Yeah. Um that that was definitely one I told her about before the auction happened, uh, given what I had a feeling I was gonna have to spend on it. But um nonetheless, the the bigger challenge was figuring out how to get it across the Atlantic. Uh so it was a whirlwind day. I uh I honestly this sounds weird to say, but I didn't even take the day off from work because I flew out of Birmingham early afternoon. So I, you know, drove to the airport during when I would have had lunch, essentially. And then I worked on my laptop during the afternoon and during my flight. It was an overnight flight going over there, and then I worked on the entire flight home coming back across the following day. So I I quite literally flew over to England and back without taking a vacation day on two weekdays.
SPEAKER_01That's wild.
SPEAKER_00That's awesome. So, how how have you preserved that golf ball? Uh, so the the interesting thing about featheries is that I I mean, firstly, if it survived 175 years, it can survive a lot, uh thankfully. Um But for for me, from a preservation standpoint, because that's another major uh piece to my collecting kind of mindset, is making sure that if something comes into my collection, that if and when it ever leaves my collection, it's leaving in the same exact condition that it came in. I want to make sure that I'm preserving things appropriately. Uh so with the golf ball in particular, the biggest thing for me is making sure that it never really experiences any type of high humidity. Um so for for instance, uh when my wife and I a couple of months ago, yeah, uh living in Florida is a great place for me to be with it. Um but uh when my wife and I moved to Florida a couple of months ago, we had everything, we had probably 70% of our belongings that we put into a storage pod. Outdoor furniture, miscellaneous boxes, you know, seasonal, you know, decorations, that kind of stuff. Um 30% was put into a U-Haul that I drove down and I was towing Jordan's car behind a U-Haul. And then the last little bit, including our three dogs, Jordan drove down in my pickup truck. Well, as we packed up the house, we're packing everything up into different boxes, and I had a small box, you know, it uh maybe 12 by 12 by 18, give or take the size. That um, well, it was items that are a little bit too conditional sensitive for me to feel comfortable with it, you know, definitely not comfortable with it sitting in a storage pod for a month, and did not feel comfortable with it sitting in a U-Haul for, you know, an eight-hour drive from Birmingham down to Florida where we were moving. So I put all these items into this box and I put on the top of the box, must go in the cab of the pickup truck. So it went in the cab of the pickup truck in the front seat with Jordan, and she had the three dogs in the backseat, when pretty much everything else of our personal belongings was in the pod, the U-Haul, or the bed of my pickup truck. But that was the one box that I said, nope, that's gotta be in the bed of the pickup truck or in the bot uh um cab of the pickup truck, because that's gonna be air conditioned the whole drive down.
unknownRight, right.
SPEAKER_01Uh wow. Yeah, and uh the where my mind immediately went was like, oh no, if a dog gets a hold of this golf ball, yeah, which is is a terrifying thought to even consider.
SPEAKER_00It it is, it is, and one of my golf balls is very ball, or one of my dogs is very golf ball motivated. Uh, so anytime I have one out, like I can't hit a putt in my office without that dog freaking out and wanting to attack the golf ball. So it's in a display case that, you know, when I get the rest of my office uh, you know, and and displays hung, uh, it's got a special shelf it's gonna sit on with a locked display so it can't fall off the shelf.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that's awesome. That's awesome. Um, so we've gotten to or have met each other by virtue of being part of um the best ball family of podcasts. You uh and Nate Oxman are the guys behind that's good pick it up. Um do it if you can, a quick little blurb uh on that's good pick it up and and what you guys are showcasing there on that podcast.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it's uh it's still still very new to me, honestly. Um I need to give 110% of the credit to Nate up until this point. Uh he's really been the driving force to getting it, getting it going and having it going in in the direction that it has been. Um I literally only joined uh after he and and Robbie reached out to me maybe 60 days ago, which was right before my move to Florida and trip to Scotland. So I haven't really done all that much with him yet, other than a few small things. But that's good. Pick it up is a podcast that Nate originally started. I'm now gonna kind of step in to co-host it with him, uh, basically to put a spotlight on a variety of things within the game of golf, but primarily golf books, um, and being able to give a platform to golf book authors, golf writers to be able to talk about their experiences, their writing, their research, their history, uh, and their backgrounds. Uh so Nate's done a phenomenal job of uh of interviewing different authors and and diving into different golf books. Uh, but that obviously ties in with uh different venture that that um I created last year, I founded last year that we'll touch on, I'm sure, uh, involving golf books and golf history books. So uh it's been uh really exciting. Um really excited to to dive deeper into it with with Nate here in the coming months.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_01So so talk about that. You're you're working with authors. Is it specifically just golf books, or is it kind of a wide range of books, or does it stay more in that vertical?
SPEAKER_00So it's it's only golf books. Uh it's literally only golf that that I focus on. Um I founded a company last year called Old Grey Toon Golf Books and Collectibles. Um Old Grey Toon being uh a Scottish nickname for St. Andrews. So it's an ode to to St. Andrews and kind of the heritage of golf, essentially. Um but I founded the company last year basically as an uh an import distributor for golf history books from writers overseas. So there's a number of fantastic, fantastic historians and and writers in the UK, both England and Scotland, as well as overseas in Europe and down in Australia that have written many, many different golf history books. And those authors historically have had a very challenging time getting those books into the American market. So the this idea was born out of um a friendship that I have with golf author and historian Roger McStravic to basically help promote and import and distribute and sell his books, because he's written, I think, 10 or 12 golf history books now, uh, throughout the United States and Canada. And since then, I've now added several additional authors, uh, including several that have written books for the RNA, uh, as well as uh golf author and historian Steven Proctor, uh, as well as Mungo Park, uh, who's a descendant of Mungo Park, who won an open championship, as well as Willie Park Jr. and Willie Park Sr., who won the very first open championship, and most recently uh starting to promote and distribute books for uh golf writer Alan Shipnock as well. So it's been a tremendous year and a half, almost two years now. We're in August, almost two years now, uh, for me with Old Great Toon to be able to help promote their works and and help share the history of the game through the research and the hard work that these guys have have put into their lives.
SPEAKER_01That's incredible. What do you think the reasoning is behind those books not making it to the States?
SPEAKER_00Shipping costs. Okay. So without a doubt, that is that that is the number one reason. Um and the the example that that I always give is before, you know, years ago, before I founded the company, I once bought one of Roger McStavik's books, and the distributor that he has in Scotland shipped it to me. The book itself cost $75. Shipping cost $65. So it almost doubled the cost of the book for me uh to get this book that I really wanted to read over to this side of the Atlantic. Yeah. So with what I'm doing, I'm able to bring the books over and import them in bulk and then have the inventory here, which helps drastically lower that uh acquisition cost and shipping cost for uh American golfers and readers.
SPEAKER_01That's incredible. So you you you became a logistics company for golf books.
SPEAKER_00Essentially, yeah, a logistics company for golf books and golf history. That's a good way to put it.
SPEAKER_01That's incredible. That's incredible. John, this has been uh a lot of fun to chat. I loved hearing about your your trip to Scotland, your experience at Mearfield, um, and then everything that you're doing just with the game of golf to to uh not necessarily grow the game, but to help people learn more about the game. I think those are different uh different avenues for people to experience golf in different ways. Um yeah, that's that is fascinating. Uh I got a couple little quick questions and we'll get you out of here. Um I very much appreciate you taking the time today to do this. This has been, like I said, a fun chat. Uh what's your favorite club in the bag right now?
SPEAKER_00Uh favorite club in the bag. Um I'd say my putter only because I made uh just a exorbitant amount of putts this past uh this past Sunday when I played around to golf with uh a couple of co-workers. Uh so that was that definitely the putter right now. Normally it's my driver. Right now it's the putter temporarily. Okay.
SPEAKER_01Um other than the the jacket that we talked about that is no longer part of your collection and the the golf ball that old Tom Morris constructed, what is your favorite artifact in your collection?
SPEAKER_00Um my let me let me give you two. One that's smaller, uh, but but carries a lot of metaphorical weight, and then the anchor that that uh I've I've touched on a little bit before, and and anybody who's followed me on Twitter has has seen me post about it. So the smaller one, uh sorry for my dogs barking in the background. The smaller one uh is a rookie card of old Tom Morris, uh, which was made in printed in in 1900. Uh so it's a little over 125 years old, obviously. Um, but uh there's I think only 50 or 60 uh that are known to still exist. And I've been fortunate to own and and resell uh a number of them uh over the years. Uh I've probably handled six to eight of them uh throughout the years, but um I I have one that's uh that that's very special that that admittedly is in in pretty rough condition, which I appreciate. I I like memorabilia memorabilia and cards that have wear and and sh and are well loved, uh I'll I'll call it because it means that they've been handled, it means that they've been appreciated throughout their life. Uh so I I I keep that in my collection. That's a really, really special piece. Um and then the other one is a visitor's book, and this is what uh anybody who's followed me on Twitter uh has probably seen me post about this before. It's a visitors uh like entry book for the Russax Hotel, which is the famous hotel that sits along the 18th Fairway uh at the old course in St. Andrews. Um this particular visitor's book uh is from the 1930s and contains a little over 470 names of international visitors that were checking in to the Russax Hotel between 1933 and 1939. So I've I've been able to identify up to this point about half the names I've been able to decipher. Um, but I've been able to identify probably 20 to 25 incredible, incredible historical stories and ties to some of the names and entries within the book. Some of which are golf related, some of which are politics related, some of which are world event related. Uh, I'll I'll phrase it as. So it's been a tremendous artifact for me to have in my collection, but also a tremendous research tool uh for me to dive into and continue to learn more about the individuals that stayed at the Russax Hotel in that period of the late 1930s.
SPEAKER_01That's incredible. I've got all kinds of wheels turning because I'm sure as you've researched each of those individuals and their own historical significance, you're seeing things that, like, oh, that person was there just a month before this person or a year before this person, and and how there was potentially uh historical significance of them meeting one another at a later date, whether it's a a political figure, like that that is really, really cool.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, there's there's so many intricacies to the entries in this book. It's it's quite literally beyond comprehension because I haven't even comprehended uh and been able to piece it all together. It's it's this kind of um it's this impossible puzzle to complete. But I say that as I say that I I I'll add that um I'm I've got this idea for a book that I want to write about this book, where I I want to basically take the top 20 to 30 stories that I've identified from the entries within the book and tell those stories and then tie it in with high-resolution images of the I think it's like twenty five or twenty-six pages worth of entries in this book. Um, so I've got this idea of sharing the history of the Russax Hotel, sharing the history of this visitor's book and all of the history that comes along with the entries, everything from Francis Weimet's autograph when he signed it, checking in with the U.S. Walker Cup team in 1937, to Bobby Jones. Um, it wasn't Bobby Jones' handwriting, but Bobby Jones's entry when he and his wife checked in in 1936, ahead of going over to attend the uh Summer Olympics in Berlin that summer, to Bob Hope, to John F. Kennedy, to a future king of England. There are so many names within this book, and I want to be able to tell the stories behind their visits and put it into a form that can help share the history of the hotel and the history of kind of St. Andrews and the the uh kind of cultural uh lives that that it impacted.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Wow. I'm at a loss for words. That that is, yeah. Well, I I I hope you achieve the goal of writing that book because just the glimpse that would give into the past, right? Of of what those people were doing at that point in time. I mean, you touched on the Walker Cup and the Olympics and and President Kennedy, like that, and I guess he wasn't president yet, right?
SPEAKER_00Um He was only been 20 years old when he wasn't president yet.
SPEAKER_01That is that is very, very cool. Um Wow, yeah. Please, please do that.
SPEAKER_00I would love that Needless to say, that's the uh that's that's one of the other favorite items in my collection. Yeah, for sure. That just like the golf ball, the butterflies for that not going away anytime soon.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. I love that. Well, John, thank you again very much for for taking time today to come on the show and chat. Um, I would love for us to get to tee it up sometime. Uh I don't know if you ever make it back to Birmingham at all, but if you do, give me a shout. Um, would love to play and spend some time together.
SPEAKER_00Absolutely. I appreciate you having me on. And yeah, well, I'll I'll definitely make it back up there at some point. Anytime you're down in Central Florida, uh anywhere near basically uh well, let's call it Jacksonville, Orlando, or Tampa, I can make happen. I'm gonna give smack dab in between all three of them. So um anytime you want to come down to Florida, we'll tee it up down here too.
SPEAKER_01Perfect, perfect. Well, for John Morton, I'm Josh Decker, and this has been another episode of Off the Deck.
